Jaipur Diaries 3: Niall Ferguson on The Ascent of Money (Part 1)

I’ve always thought of Niall Ferguson as an economist and, like many others, have stereotyped him as one: an intense looking Harvard professor wearing thick-rimmed spectacles always talking about numbers, policies, currencies, growth rates, cartels, oligarchies, fiscal deficits, stimulus packages…you get the drift.

But I was wrong on both counts. Firstly, Niall is not an economist; he is a historian who specialises in financial as well as the history of colonialism. Secondly, he is extremely good-looking and one of the wittiest speakers I’ve ever heard. He is the author of 13 books including the much-acclaimed Pity of War, Empire and The War of the World. But at the Jaipur Literature Festival, Niall spoke about his latest work The Ascent of Money: A Financial History of the World. Read on.

While introducing his book, Niall said that a few issues which he examines, among others things, the globalisation of the current financial system. Niall said that the international financial system is a part of “everyone’s lives”. “It’s a story of where this thing came from: Planet Finance; this giant, extraordinarily complex system which will affect your life, that will give and take our money, whether you like it or not!” quipped Niall. But who we blame, asks moderator Omair Ahmad. “Not me!” replies Niall, amidst peals of laughter from the audience. According to Niall, it’s easy to come up with simplistic explanations for a crisis of this magnitude. “For a time, there was a fashion to blame Greenspan, former chairman of the Federal Reserve. Then, we decided to blame Goldman Sachs and its rebranding as a giant vampire squid was one of the remarkable phenomena of the past year. In some ways, it resembles those Russian trials of the late 19^th century when the jury would refuse to convict a murderer because, as the Russian Tsar said, we are all guilty” added the Harvard professor. “In some ways, we all are complicit – at least in the Western world – because the financial crisis couldn't have happened if it hadn’t been for the reckless behaviour of millions and millions of house loans that run up debts in excess of anything you’ve ever seen!” Niall exclaimed.

“Countries like Britain, Ireland, the United States, Spain and Iceland achieved unprecedented levels of indebtedness – and in a relatively short timeframe. So, I think before anyone says ‘it’s all the fault of Greenspan or Lloyd Blankfein (Goldman Sachs CEO) or some ruthless investment banker, I think one has to step back and realise that, the financial system is a highly complex one and involves decisions by millions of individual actions” explained Niall.  He adds that he went to Michigan in the United States to study the subprime mortgage crisis and found the process “fascinating”. “It’s absolutely fascinating to get inside the process whereby, a relatively low-income American family takes on an amount of debt that everybody knows is unsustainable” said Ferguson. In his assessment, “ignorance” was the cause of the subprime crisis. 

“Ignorance of financial history and elementary things like interest rates.  We (need to) educate people who really matter in this stuff. And our courses on economics and finance, at close suspection, turn out to be really bad” lamented the Harvard professor. Niall added people who worked on Wall Street and were closely involved in the financial system knew “very little” about financial history. “That’s why they find it so hard to imagine that a great depression might happen to them.”

“Most people who are operating based on their personal experience did not know much about financial crises before the early 1980’s. And they had no idea that, in 2007, they were close to as big a crisis as 1929”. And that, Niall said, was the main reason for him to write The Ascent of Money.

Omair went on to suggest that money is a way of educating people as it attaches a value to something (in this case, a stock) and helps a prospective buyer judge the stock based on the value. So isn’t the financial market screwed up in educating us, in a manner of speaking enquired Omair.

“I would put it slightly differently. It’s the process (of buying and selling) which is educational. The money is a relationship between buyer and seller, between a creditor and a debtor.  The earliest money, which dates back to 4500 years in the form of clay tablets – the size of credit cards – states that X promises to pay Y, the bearer, a specified amount on a certain commodity on a certain date. He (X) crystalises that relationship that transcends time and space because you can settle the debt hundreds of miles away from where you are. So, the money really is just a relationship between the debtor and creditor. Even today, the money that you carry around with you or that you imagine is in your bank – it’s not there!” gasped Niall. “That’s called fractional reserve banking – a 17^th century Swedish invention – which means that when you deposit money in the bank, they take that money and lend it to somebody else. Don’t be fooled; if we wanted all the money at once, banking systems around the world would crash; that’s something that investors at the British bank, Northern Rock discovered not so long ago” Niall quipped.

According to Niall, prices are just signals which “express value”. “But these prices, in a free market, are only arrived at by our collective expectations of what something is worth right now and what it’ll be worth in future” Niall went on to explain that as human beings, our collective mood-swings help determine the value of a commodity in future. “Human psychology, which is very volatile, is magnified when we act collectively and financial markets reflect them; they reflect that there’s been this extraordinary switch from greed to fear. The same people who worked in investment banks and hedge funds in late 2006 and early 2007, bet with me that there will never be another recession in the United States.  So, the relationships which money crystalises are as volatile as the ones we forge in our emotional lives” added Niall.

Veering the discussion towards an Indian context, Omair remarked that since India’s political and economic cisterns remain fragile; we may not be able to afford these mood-swings. What does Niall makes of this? The Harvard professor replied “India’s experience over the last twenty years has been fascinating because unlike many Commonwealth countries, India’s economic miracles – and I think we can call it an economic miracle – have been based not on trade or on foreign direct investment or on globalisation. India’s growth has been primarily a result of a significant increase in savings and investment within India itself. Also, a growth of demand for domestic goods in India; that means India is much less exposed to crises of globalisation than China is where trade has played a much larger role in generating growth.  India has run a modest current account deficit while China has the enormous and ever-growing surplus. In some ways, India hasn’t attempted to grow as fast as China; it’s a little bit like the story of the tortoise and the hare”.

Niall added that China’s reform process started in 1978 which is why it’s economy is now three-and-a-half times larger than India and, by 2021, that figure will go up to four-and-a-half. In essence, India isn’t running as fast as it should be.

This is part 1 of what is a really long recording. Due to time constraints (and long hours of transcribing), part 2 will go up either tonight or tomorrow. Do comment on what you thought of this post. Hope you enjoyed reading this and the other Jaipur diaries as well. 

On The Go

Was in Bombay recently for over a week and hectic socialising with friends and family meant very little reading. But I did manage to flip through some pages here and there. Here are a few reccomendations from whatever little I've read.

Pundits from Pakistan by Rahul Bhattacharya: Journalist-turned-writer Rahul Bhattacharya pens a wonderful account of India's cricket tour to Pakistan in 2004- the first in 15 years. For Bhattacharya, cricket is not merely a sport but a prism through which he views the lives, events and incidents associated with it. His interaction with Pakistani leggie Danish Kaneria and Kaneria's family is one of the most poignant passages of the book. Kaneria, a Hindu, describes how normal life is in Pakistan despite belonging to a religious minority. Another passage, interspersing the assassination bids on General Musharraf with the security arrangements for the Indian team, is remarkably well-written. For any young urban Indian growing up in the mid-90's deprived of top quality Indian cricket literature (biogs and autobiogs aside), Pundits from Pakistan comes as a breath of fresh air. A real cracker of a book! (Thanks, Jai, for the reccomendation)

Churchill by Roy Jenkins: One of the most exhaustive, erudite yet tedious biographies I've ever come across. And when it begins with the phrase, 'The ducality of his provenance', you know you'll always need a dictionary if you are serious about reading this 1000-page tome.Written by eminent British parliamentarian Roy Jenkins, this is one of the finest biographies to have been written about one of the most controversial statesmen of the 20th century. Foreign Affairs called it a "liberal history of Britain". The Observer said that "Churchill is a life brilliantly reflected in the mirror of its author's personality and experience."

Released as late as 2001, Churchill is an exhaustive work; something that only a veteran politician like Jenkins can write. For he had the advantage of not only being able to access previous works on Churchill but also to interact with him as a parliamentarian. But thanks to the tedious language I've barely managed to finish one chapter. Will start reading the book again soon - with a dictionary at hand!

Foreign Correspondent: 50 years of reporting in South Asia: As a sucker for journalistic writing, this book was on the top my must-have list and I'm glad I've finally bought it. Published jointly by the Foreign Correspondents Club and Penguin India, this anthology was brought out to commemorate the golden jubilee of the FCC. Not only is it a collection of the finest pieces to have appeared in foreign newspapers/magazines, but it also illustrates a sad but growing trend: the decline of long-form feature writing. If you're a frequent reader of Indian newspapers and magazines, you'd probably agree that exquisitely written, enjoyable yet informative essays are limited only to a few columnists. Otherwise, most newspapers and magazines have become mere wire-copy publishers. Even then, they're so poorly edited that you feel like consigning them to the dustbin after reading the first sentence itself.

Hence, this anthology comes as a breath of fresh air. Pieces range from Delhi in the 50s to the rise of the BJP in the 1980s. From an erudite obituary of Jawarharlal Nehru to a gripping account of Rajiv Gandhi's assassination and its aftermath. For anyone who is interested in contemporary Indian history - if not long-form, journalistic writing - this is a must on your bookshelf.

Liberty Or Death: India's Journey to Independence and Division by Patrick French: I first became a fan of Patrick French's writing not too long ago when I read this piece by him for Tehelka. A year later, his biography of V S Naipaul, The World Is What It Is, won critical acclaim and was one of the bestsellers for 2008. I looked up Patrick's bio on the net and found that he'd written two other books apart from his Naipaul, Liberty Or Death and another one on Tibet. Being a sucker for books on Indian independence and partition, I chose to buy Liberty Or Death over the Naipaul bio. But that's not the only reason I picked up the book

Released in 1997, Liberty Or Death evoked mixed responses. While Philip Ziegler, Lord Mountbatten's official biographer, states that Patrick has tackled "..a subject of extreme complexity, calling for scholarhip", eminent Indian journalist Swapan Dasgupta pooh-poohs it, stating that the book is nothing but "...a delightful tale of intrigue, ham-handedness and just plain blundering". One Indian journalist has gone to the extent of calling it a piece of "yellow journalism". And I can understand why. Basically, Patrick doesn't revere the leaders who negotiated India's independence and partition with the British. Instead, he's quite critical and even irreverent about them. For example, French has this to write about Gandhi:

If Gandhi is your hero, it can be a deflating experience to read what he actually did and said at crucial points in India's political history. The authorised version of the Mahatma is very different from the real one. Far from being a wise and balanced saint, Gandhi was an emotionally troubled social activist and a ruthlessly sharp political negotiator. As India's Transport Minister John Mathai said in 1947, the final failure to reach a satisfactory settlement with the Muslim League stemmed in from the 'Gujarati mentality' of the Congress leadership - i.e. 'that of a trader driving a hard bargain'

Now I haven't read the entire book but if this passage is anything to go by, then I'm sure there are plenty of uncharitable references to Nehru, Patel, Jinnah and even Churchill and Attlee. But, irreverent references notwithstanding, I think Liberty Or Death is an important read. For far too long, we've had a one-sided opinion about partition and independence. Patrick's book gives us the 'other side' of this epochal event. Might help to balance opinions- if not change them.

Other books I procured in Bombay but haven't read include Amartya Sen's Idea of Justice and Mani Shankar Aiyar's A Time of Transition. Haven't got down to even opening the packets so you'll have to wait for a while before I write about them

Finally, of all my socialising events, the one that I enjoyed most was with fellow blogger Hash. We roamed around the beautiful areas of Fort and Kala Ghoda and stopped at second hand bookshops before settling down at the quaint Kala Ghoda cafe for some organic nimbu paani. Oh, and in between we also visited the Strand book store (only to find it shut for the day) and The Bombay Store (which, in my opinion, should either revamp its stationary section or close it down completely). And post the Kala Ghoda cafe, we checked out the Oxford bookstore only to find that it hadn't stocked Hash's book for over 2 or 3 weeks! Not good for a debut novelist. Not good at all. Anyway, thanks Hash for the wonderful evening. We should do this once again when I visit Bombay again in November.

Oh, and don't think the Bombay rambling is over yet. Part 2 of the foodie tales is coming up soon.

In Conversation with Aatish Taseer

The author of Stranger To History: A Son's Journey Through Islamic Lands on his book, his travels, religion and identity.

Its tough categorizing your book as an autobiography or a travelogue since it’s a mix of travel, religion and your own personal journey. How would you like to describe Stranger to History?

Well it is part autobiography and there’s an element of travel in it. Also, things that seem religious, cultural or historical in the region I was traveling in, became part of the compass of the religion (Islam). So yes, there were these many strands. Obviously, I shy away from describing this book as one thing or the other and that’s because most of my writing – fiction or non-fiction – begins in a personal way. So it’s not a book which can be described easily.

When you were at this place, Fatih Carasamba, in Turkey you came across – what you describe – as a ‘sub-culture’. Did it remind you of any other ‘sub-culture’ which existed in any other city?

Funnily enough, I thought a little bit of punk cultures in Western cities. It had something of that quality because it was so enclosed and because there was an element of ‘fancy dress’. It may also be because of black cultures in American cities; because of the way they dress.

Even in terms of attitude? Because with aggression comes a certain amount defensiveness.

Yes, there was something. I think when people have taken on a new kind of dress or a new kind of identification there can often be some kind of aggression about that.

The book starts off in Mecca which is the mid-point of your journey. Why did you choose the middle of your journey as the start to your book?

Mecca was more than a mid-point – it was a turning point. And that’s because it was the point in the journey when I could separate what part of the traveling had to do with faith, in the sense of what was articles of faith – the kind that I had known to make that journey. But it was also a moment when I understood that, for me to understand my father better or to understand what had happened between us better and to understand the division of India-Pakistan better, I wouldn’t need faith in the book sense of the word. I would need it in what was part of the larger compass of the faith. Therefore, I wanted to drop the reader in Mecca because he would need to remember it later; to know what had come before and to see what was the change in the direction


In your quest to understand your father’s religion better, did you ever feel that your identity as a Sikh was being lost or overshadowed?

No I didn’t and that’s because the Sikh identity – as a religious identity – has never been an active part. What I did find - in Pakistan - was that the larger Indian identity, cultural and civilisational, which was very close to me, was a pressure to step away from. It wasn’t something that Pakistanis could deal with easily. So it wasn’t a very religious thing. It was more to do with Pakistan’s troubles with India and with the fact that, in India, to include a kind of Pakistani identity is no problem. India has always had these kinds of hybrid identities. It was more of a problem in Pakistan where India was a country to be feared.

Did you ever try to dispel these notions from the minds of the Pakistanis?

Well it was never done in a conscious manner. It was done in subtler ways. For instance, when my brother is making fun of how ugly people in India are, or, there might be a joke in the family about how Hindus are cowardly or small. Or they might make fun of the Sanskritic influence on the language. So often, it was in the context of a joke

There’s a point in your book where you write about your name being neither Hindu nor Muslim. Did you ever try to find out what your name meant?

I did. I knew what Aatish meant from a very early age. And Taseer was my grandfather’s takhhallus - his pen name which I discovered as I grew older. So yes I always knew what it was.

In your book, Abdullah talks about this whole ‘world system’ and its clash with Islam. While you were in London after 9/11, did you come across any person or place which echoed Abdullah’s sentiments?

I had already left London when I was traveling in Turkey and I never traveled in England in that way. But, by the time I had met Abdullah, I was familiar with that reaction. What was interesting to me was that somebody like Abdullah, even in a Turkish context, was not in any way part of Turkey’s traditional Islam. He was as new as those people in Beeston were. And his faith was not very different from theirs. There was a rediscovery of faith in a streamlined, literal manner that made him much closer to somebody in Beeston. There were people like him cropping up in the Muslim world, except maybe for Iran, everywhere. Their outlook was similar and their reaction to this ‘world system’ was similar and their Islam was very radical, very new. It hadn’t grown out of the traditional Islam of a country but was an import. It followed a kind of a Saudi Islam but it was brought in in the last 20 or 30 years.

Your book highlights Syria and Turkey as juxtaposed with one another since the former is an Arab-nationalist country and the latter a very secular one. Was it difficult to adjust to both these countries during your travel?

Syria required adjustments since it was a policed State so it was a very different kind of country. What I was trying to show was that Abdullah is by no means representative of all of Turkey and that is clear in the book. He is a representative of a particular experience with religion at a certain time in the last century and of almost what a conspicuous absence it was. Turkey’s secularism was not secularism the way any of us would understand; it doesn’t mean that there is a separation between the Church and the State. It means that the State has co-opted the Mosque; they write Friday sermons and appoint the mullahs. So, in a sense, secularism has itself been a religion for Turkey.

So in a sense Turkey is also a policed State..

No it’s not a policed State. But it’s very aggressive in this secularism and the reason why it’s interesting is because Ataturk obviously perceived a threat from the Islamic identity and he dealt with it in a very strong way. So when you look at Turkey, it’s experience with religion has not been benign – it has been explosive in its own way. But in Syria religion was clamped down and has become an instrument in the hands of the regime – a way to excite people’s deepest affiliations. So what I was trying to show that the problem of the modern State and Islam in all of these countries, though in different incarnations, has been a real 20th century problem and no one has been able to bypass it entirely.

You were in Syria when the Prophet Mohammad cartoon controversy broke out and there were protests outside the Danish embassy turned ugly. Do you think this controversy provided people an excuse to vent their anger?

I think it was a form of release and probably a State-orchestrated form of release where this population - stamped down, given very little outlet – and then you have something like this. It becomes almost like a festival. Its encouraged by the State to redirect peoples’ passion and frustration. And to use something as harmless as cartoons to enflame them and target a faceless edifice like an embassy till the next thing comes along.

The one noticeable aspect about your book is that, although it is a travelogue, it’s a very dark account which, at times, can depress the reader. Were you going through any tough times during your travels which reflect in Stranger To History?

Yes, there hard moments. I think Syria was hard partly because to live under that kind of repression for many months can be difficult. And Iran was very painful. Very painful to see people who you though were full of possibilities but were beaten down by the regime. And Pakistan filled me with despair because I felt they’d fallen into a trap where religion was concerned and I couldn’t see how they’d get out of it. Also the commonality (with Pakistanis) is difficult for them to accept because it negates the idea of Pakistan. So every time this comes up, they can, at best, grudgingly accept it but they can hardly celebrate it.

And is this attitude prevalent only within a section of Pakistani society?

No, it runs throughout. But, obviously, people who are more educated are able to have more nuanced reactions. But the reactions are the same.

How was Pakistan similar to or different from Syria, Turkey, Saudi Arabia and Iran?

If you look at all these countries – as a result of a certain experience with the modern State – they have dealt with religion in particular ways. In that sense, Pakistan’s position has been the most final. That impulse to find a secular State for Indian Muslims was also part of what was happening in the 20th century with Islam across the world. However, Pakistan’s break in a sense was more extreme because Iran, for instance, would’ve still remained Iran even if the Iranian revolution were to end. But for Pakistan, if this bad idea were to end, it would be difficult to imagine a way forward.

Considering the nature of your parentage and the media hype surrounding this book, most people may buy it in the hope of reading some controversial gossip. Was that the reason why you chose travel as the narrative tool for Stranger To History?

No. The book has been many years in the making. I was trying to deal with the personal bits of it through fiction and parts of it have been almost four or five years old. But I came to the understanding that I couldn’t look at my father in a completely personal way. That the context of Pakistan’s relationship with Islam and what had happened to Pakistan in all these was also important to my understanding. And especially since it came up very directly between my father and I. There was this article which had brought us to this kind of impasse affecting the personal relationship. Once all these things came into my mind, I decided not to look at it in a personal way.

But that doesn’t mean that it can’t be looked at it in a personal way. Take, for instance, Madam Bovary, and her greed for personal issues or you can look at it as a description of France in a particular time in history. So once I realized that the book had to have other contexts, the personal was always a means to enter a bigger situation. And also, I wouldn’t have held back on the personal because I think that is also part of the life of the book.

Your father described himself as a “cultural Muslim”. How many cultural Muslims have you encountered in your travels or otherwise?

The term is deceptive because it gives a sense of feeling for festivals and religion in a very passive way. What I found with my father - and I find more and more with moderate Muslims with very few exceptions – is that this word includes historical and political attitudes with a religious quality. Some of their anger on political issues has almost the force of faith. And while I was growing up in Delhi I’ve known many cultural Muslims. But in the post 9/11-era this has become more noticeable. Muslims have felt a need to speak for their identity and its brought up a lot of confusion regarding where the religious identity stops and the political takes over.

But inside the Islamic world, how comfortable are Muslims – moderate and extreme – with their identity?

There seems to be a grinding down of the old Muslim world and due to this there is a kind of a reaction – a retreat – in the face of a feeling of attack. A feeling that your being robbed of your past…a sense of grievance. But walking alongside that is the fact that most people are drawn in by the appeal of a bigger world and its possibilities; in terms of government, the kind of laws you live under and economic possibilities. So, inside the Muslim world, they are aware of this phenomenon and that they have to make their peace with this situation.

And do you any similarities or differences between Indian Muslims and the people in the Muslim world?

I think that there’s a previous situation in which there were varied forms of Islam. The Islam that evolved in India was a world apart from the Islam of Arabia. It was a hybrid and I think these hybrids happened at different points when the Muslim world came into contact with different cultures. But this new Islam is more an attack on local forms of Islam than it is even on the West. That local kind of religion is failing everywhere in Pakistan or in India and the people that its throwing up are part of a global Muslim experience. There are attitude that do link them. So of course the Islamic world is not monolithic but the problem or this reaction has been happening in different ways.

Lastly, what are you working on next? Will you be tackling another complex theme?

Well I haven’t started speaking about it yet. But it’s a novel set in Delhi and its part comedy which will be out next year. And I’ll write it in a manner which seems closer to non-fiction than fiction.

(A shorter version of this interview can be read here)

(Image courtesy: Aatish Taseer)

Coming Soon

Sorry for the disappearance act people, but I've been quite busy over the past fortnight. Balancing between work and planning further studies isn't as simple as it may seem. But, in between, I've been doing some work for this blog as well.

Got in touch with Patrick French and will be doing an interview with him about his book, Liberty or Death. This will be a blog exclusive so you won't find it anywhere else but here. However, it won't be posted before the end of this month/early next month because I still have to start reading the book.

Reviewed Aatish Taseer's much-awaited debut Stranger To History: A Son's Journey Through Islamic Lands. An engaging, insightful read about the Islamic world. Also had the opportunity to interview the young man, and we hit it off quite well (the dude has an enviable study!). These will be put up very shortly; as soon as I receive the go-ahead from the BW peeps.

Will also be posting the review of Mukul Deva's Salim Must Die. A short interview with him can be read here.

For now, all I can say is regular blogging will suffer since I'm planning further studies and trying to balance work alongside. Still, I'll try and post as often as I can. Watch this space for more!

In Conversation with Mukul Deva

It's tough describing Mukul Deva. You could call him a former army officer turned author whose writings span such different genres as short stories, business leadership, women in Indian cinema, corporate warfare and crime fiction. But then, he's also an entrepreneur who runs a security firm in New Delhi. In addition, Deva is also a corporate trainer on disaster management and business continuity. So, who exactly is Mukul Deva? 

"At heart I am a writer. But in India writers starve so I have to run a business to sustain my passion hence I am a businessman. Deep down, I am still an army man because you can take a guy out of the army but not the army out of the guy." Finding time to write amidst managing all the roles is a tough task, but not for Deva. "I have a two-hour window where I only write. I need six hours to run my business and four hours to be with my kids and family. I sleep, watch movies and read during the remaining 12 hours!"

Born in Lucknow in 1961, Deva is an alumnus of the La Martiniere College, Lucknow, the National Defence Academy, Pune and the Indian Military academy in Dehradun. He was an army officer until 1981, after which he took premature retirement and started his security business in New Delhi. 

Although Deva's writings span a various genres, his most widely acclaimed book has beenLashkar, an action thriller based on the 2005 blasts in Sarojini Nagar in New Delhi. And his latest offering is its sequel Salim Must Die with terrorism as its central theme. 

About his books Deva says "I wrote Lashkar because I was angry at the way these terrorists were striking at us. Also, given my army background I had a potent story to tell which gave me another reason to write it. While writing Lashkar, the principal characters — Anbu and Iqbal — were literally crying to be taken forward which is why I am doing a four-book series of which Salim Must Die is the second." 

Despite his anger, Deva prefers to confine to writing and not be in the fore to assist investigations given his army credentials. "You know, the Indian government, over the last 30 years has proven its inability to think strategically," he says. "They think in tactical, short-term methods. They are trying to cure the symptom and not tackle the disease. So, I thought writing a book which would actually tell the public about other alternatives to the government's actions" reasons Deva. 

On his books, Deva says that both his works are completely different from each other. "I found to my horror that, a lot of what I wrote in Salim.. a year-and-a-half back, is coming true already." He sounds like a soothsayer when he says he "wishes he would have also been able to foresee the sensex falling"! On a serious note, Deva attributes his predictions to logic and history. He says "History has a habit of repeating itself and whatever I have written is firmly grounded in reality and in history. And although these are fictional books, even they require bedrock somewhere.

For instance, Deva says he wrote about the newly-formed National Intelligence Agency a year-and-half ago. "So when you read it you will realise how uncannily it's coming together now." Research, he adds, plays a very important role in writing such potboilers. "For the last four years, I spend a few hours reading and understanding the smallest terror incident in the world. Else you cannot write military action thrillers. So, I have been breathing and living terror in all its forms!" 

Deva is part of a new breed of Indian writers whose works stem from incidents in everyday life. More often than not, they are criticised for not being too 'literary' (a la Chetan Bhagat and Vikas Swarup). Simple storytelling and interesting plotlines — sans highbrow language — is the key. As a result, these novels are often labelled as 'pop-literature'. 

This Delhi-based author, however, refuses to accept to be classified under these media-induced jargons. "Terms like pop-lit, chick-lit really don't matter," says Deva. "Not every story has to be Shakespearean or an Arundhati Roy," he explains. "People like Chetan Bhagat and Vikas Swarup have great stories to tell. These are stories which happen all around us and people from different backgrounds narrate them." 

And what about the highbrow language? "Dude, when you quit school in class 10, how many big words do you really know?" laughs Deva. The author deliberately chooses the potboiler narrative tool over a scholarly one as it would ensure more readers. "It's like making a movie: do you want to make it for the masses or do you want to make it for the Cannes film festival?"

Deva's reading tastes are as eclectic as his writings and he ranks Chetan Bhagat and Advaita Kala amongst his favourite authors. But his all-time favourite book is J.D. Salinger's Raise High The Roof Beam. And Deva's works are not just restricted to literature. 

About his future plans, Deva is writing a crime thriller The Shades of Black "which explores the dark side of the human mind. You know who the killer is and you know how he did it but you have to understand why he did it." Despite a prolific 'literary' journey, Deva is still unsure of any other genre he plans to explore. "I am growing as a human being and evolving in my own head. I don't know which way I will go."

This was an assignment for BusinessWorld Online. You can also read it here

In Pictures: The Jaipur litfest

Since I've already written a short summary about the literature festival, I thought it wise to do a photo-feature of the event. And as it is, the blog is very...umm...texty so I think a photo-feature will provide the much needed balance. Enjoy!

Sonia Falerio in conversation with Vikram Seth.

An amusing and lively start to the proceedings. Seth joked about how unfair mum Leila was when she threw him off the bestseller list with her debut novel. As he sipped red wine, Seth also recounted how neighbours were perplexed when told that Seth would spend most of his time just writing! His friends called him a "gregarious hermit" and, as he sipped his red wine, Seth recounted how his parents were a bit worried when he wanted to quit studying at Stanford and become a full-time writer ("Son, why don't you first finish studying and then think about writing?"). However, next day, the local press wasn't amused about his wine-drinking traits!

William Dalrymple, Siddharth Varadarajan, Malise Ruthven and Basharat Peer discuss the fundamentals of fundamentalism.

A profound and engaging session which opened with Dalrymple introducing the panelists and Ruthven making the opening remarks. Peer talked about how women in the Kashmir valley live under the fear of the Dukhtaran-E-Millat - a radical Islamic organisation - known to deface women who are clad in western clothes. During the post session Q&A, Varadarajan said that the phrase "one man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter" holds no meaning.

Chetan Bhagat in conversation with Jai Arjun Singh and Namita Gokhale

Sometimes, an author's popularity can be judged just by the number of people who are in attendance to hear him/her speak. I reached the venue half-an-hour before Chetan's session was scheduled to start and was surprised to find half the seats filled up. Within the next 15 minutes, I saw people jostling for space and squatting on the floor. No doubt, Chetan got a rousing reception as he arrived, and went on to speak on a range of issues - being panned by critics, how 'literary' he actually is, the audience he caters to, the 'real' India which is often neglected by the media and his growth as. But the real fun started during the Q&A session, when school kids - clearly in awe of Chetan - stuttered while asking him questions. Even better were his replies. The lady sitting next to me exclaimed  "Touche!" or "Soooo Cute!" after his smart one-liners. The session was anything but literary and proved to be a great hit. In the end, it took us 15 minutes to get out of the hall as crowds gheraoed Chetan for autographs and photographs. His reaction? "Well, if such huge crowds have turned up to see me, you can very well imagine what'll happen when Mr. Bachchan arrives!"

William Dalrymple in conversation with Vikas Swarup

Firstly, whoever called this a 'session' had got it completely wrong. For, it seemed as if two long lost buddies were bantering around before an enthusiastic audience. Sample this: Willy to Vikas "If you, Navtej Sarna and a few others have started writing books, who's running India's External Affairs Ministry?". And this: (Vikas Swarup) "After the film was made, I never saw it for a long time. Suddenly, the media is scrambling for interviews and I don't have a clue. So I decided to see what the hell this movie is about!" Peppered with a generous dose of bollywood, Slumdog Millionaire and hilarious one-liners ("A diplomat will tell you to go to hell in such a manner that you actually look forward to the trip!" Vikas Swarup) the last session was a perfect way to wind up the first day. And lit up the evening which was filled with music, food and booze.

(L to R) Mohammed Hanif in conversation with Basharat Peer

Wit. That's the only word which comes to my mind when I think about this session because it was so full of it. It was also one of the few sessions where the author (in this case, Hanif) read out lengthy paragraphs from his book. That could be because Basharat's public speaking skills were pretty disappointing. But, Hanif more than made up for them as he read out passages from A Case of Exploding Mangoes (The "There is no god but Allah" one is a favourite) with the most deadpan of looks on his face. And it didn't stop here. In fact, his most quotable quote was reserved for the Q&A session. "You know, you guys should have invited Pervez Musharraf here. His autobiography is a good work of fiction!"

(L to R) Pico Iyer in conversation with Patrick French

I was very very apprehensive about attending this session. In fact, I had all but skipped it. I remember that, when I told my ex-boss about the subject of discussion, she exclaimed "Oh God!!". Clearly, not a very encouraging reaction. But, I am glad I did attend it for it was a riveting and engaging discussion about V.S. Naipaul - a man who's known for his literature yet, remains so reclusive. French read out passages from his book The World Is What It Is, Naipaul's authorised biography, leaving people bemused and curious about the Nobel laureate. Another reason why I attended the session was because I really enjoyed French's piece in Tehelka as he accompanied Nawaz Sharif on his return journey to Pakistan. 

(Lto R) Hari Kunzru in conversation with Jai Arjun Singh

By far, the most profound session of the festival.  Apparently, Hari is one of the most underrated writers of Indian origin (since I haven't read his books, I can't say for sure) and, as Jai informed us at the start of this session, My Revolutions is of very high quality but, surprisingly, didn't get due attention in India. Anyway, I started losing track of the rather 'heavy-duty' discussion soon after Hari mentioned that he was in the process of writing something which is set in the 16th century. And I'm pretty sure the audience was bored as this was perhaps the only session where the compere was looking for eager questioners!

(L to R) Shashi Tharoor in conversation with Shoma Chaudhary

A casual mention of Shashi Tharoor's session elicited an amusing response from somebody at the festival. "You know, words drip out of his mouth like oil off a baby's bottom!". And that's exactly what happened. Lucid, articulate and profound, Tharoor not only spoke about his latest book, but also about his vision for India. Be it relations with Pakistan and China or India's domestic concerns such as Naxal violence, education and poverty, Tharoor's eloquent argument held his audience in a trance. Quotable quotes? Yes, many, but his speech was so profound that I can only recall one about Pakistan. "In India, the State has the army whereas in Pakistan, the army has the State." However, the flip side of such a profound session was that the audience didn't get enough time to ask him questions. During the one hour session, Tharoor dominated proceedings for 45 minutes after which Shoma used her prerogative as moderator to ask a question. Hence, only 3 members of the audience could ask questions. 

With that, the photo feature comes to a close. Sadly, I couldn't attend the clash of civilizations debate the next day as I left for Delhi; exhausted - yet thrilled - from the experience.

P.S. A small anecdote. When the Kashmir session was about to begin, Patrick French realised that the hall was full and couldn't find a seat. I sacrificed my front row seat for his comfort in exchange for an interview ("It's a deal!" were his words). So if anyone out there has Mr French's email address/other contact details, please do let me know. :-) 

Chat with Mohammed Hanif

Author, A Case of Exploding Mangoes

What prompted you to write a such a dark and satirical novel about Zia-Ul-Haq? What was the basis for choosing the subject that you did?

I grew up during the time Gen. Zia-Ul-Haq was in power. As you know, he was a military dictator. You, probably, have not had the experience of living under one man's rule. So, it was a very bizarre time in our lives. I've always liked funny books, dark books and thrillers so even I wanted do try and do something like that.

The reason I ask is because the timeframe you chose for your book - the 80's - is interesting. A lot was happening in other parts of the world as well. The Soviet Union was about to collapse, there was a conflict raging in Afghanistan and Pakistan's relations with India weren't as good. Didn't these - or other subjects - interest you?

Well, basically, I wanted to write a murder mystery. And this has been a mystery in Pakistan as to who killed this guy? I mean, he was the all-powerful man in Pakistan for 11 years and people thought he is never going to go away. Suddenly, one fine day, his plane blows up and he dies. And nobody ever found out what might have happened. It was established that it was sabotage - that somebody had bumped him off - but nobody knew who. So, it's a readymade murder mystery. And I just thought I'll resolve it in a fictional way.

Evidently, your book reflects a lot of dark humour. What sort of books did you read and did those reading influence you while writing this novel?

Actually, I think more than books it's the talk on the streets which influenced me. During Gen. Zia's time, we had total censorship in Pakistan; whether it TV, newspapers or magazines, everything was censored. One could read books as long they weren't anti-government or anti-Zia. So, during that time, a sort of oral culture evolved. People would start rumours or jokes - and this was much before emails or SMSes had come about. So, it was quite strange that somebody sitting in Karachi would start a joke and, the next day, you'll hear it in Peshawar. Hence, this was a way for people to channelise their frustrations. I suppose it was also a kind of resistance. I guess that might have influenced the way I write.

A prominent Indian author, Chetan Bhagat, once said that, when you write your first novel, you put a lot of yourself into it. How much of yourself have you put into A Case of Exploding Mangoes? And does that reflect in any of the characters?

Sadly, no. I had a very boring and dull life. I never got into the kind of troubles that some of my characters get into. But, I have seen and observed people like that; I've read about them and met them. So, no, it's not autobiographical. But, obviously, a lot of the characters have been inspired by the kind of people I have met.

Any examples of such characters?

A lot of political prisoners in Pakistan. There were also some people who were trying to overthrow Zia and were killed. So, one keeps hearing about such people and reading about them in newspapers.

Which character from the book do you like the most?

Without doubt, Zia-Ul-Haq.

And apart from him? What about the protagonist?

I think I like the protagonist's father, Col. Shigri, who's this old-fashioned father figure sort of guy. He's only there for a chapter-and-a-half but I quite like him.

As we know, first time authors find it difficult to get their work published. Did you also face any such problems?

No. In fact, I was quite lucky. I sent it out to a couple of agents. One of them liked it, signed me up and then she did the rest. It actually happened pretty quickly. It probably doesn't happen very often but I guess I just got lucky.

You know, after the success of this book, the joke doing the rounds was that since Mohammad Hanif is shifting back to Pakistan, he might do a sequel with Pervez Musharraf. Any such plans?

(laughs). No. I think Pervez Musharraf is far too dull. And I don't think any sort of fictional treatment would be possible.

But a lot had happened during his regime.

I guess one could start a mini-industry if one starts writing about all the assassinations that have happened in India and Pakistan! But, I think I've done one and that's enough. I'll probably try and write a different kind of book next time.

So what are you writing next?

Well, I'd say I'm trying to write. It's a love story but it's just begun so I don't know what's going to happen.

Will it remain just a love story or will it have shades of crime and humour as well?

I don't know myself! I hope it will be funny or sad or have some emotion in it. But, its still early days so I really can't say what happens next.

The buzz is that 2009 will be the year of Pakistani writing. From Pakistan - and from India - which author(s)' works are you looking forward to? And who's works have enjoyed reading in the past?

I read a lot of Urdu writers. I have just finished a novel by Mirza Athar Baig which was just fantastic. I haven't read much Hindi literature but there's this Malayalam guy who's works have been translated into English. I also enjoyed Vikram Chandra's short stories, Love and Longing in Bombay. From Pakistan, I waiting for Daniyal Mueenuddin's book to come out (In Other Rooms, Other Wonders). I have read a few stories which I think are absolutely fantastic. Kamila Shamsie's book new book is coming out. I have read the manuscript and I think it's quite emphatic.

Book Review: Descent Into Chaos

(A short and tweaked book review of Ahmed Rashid's brilliant book which first appeared in What's Hot, the Times of India's friday tabloid.)

After Taliban, veteran journalist Ahmed Rashid writes a comprehensive tome on the war on terror and its impact on South and Central Asian countries.  Descent into Chaos analyses every aspect of the war in totality; the circumstances, the individuals involved, the impact it would have and most importantly, its failure to curb Islamic extremism. To say that the book is an eye-opener is a mere understatement. Rashid provides a blow-by-blow account of how America used the war to buy and bully its way into Afghanistan. Central Asian countries were granted billions of dollars in aid in exchange for their air bases. Pakistan was threatened with international isolation. NATO, the United Nations and the European Union were completely sidelined. And the 'neocons' and CIA sidelined their own State Department to dictate foreign policy. The message was clear; America was going it alone. So obsessed were Bush and his men about the war, that they weren't even interested in restoring democracy in the country (Apparently, nation building was not on Defense Secy. Rumsfeld's "agenda"). And when they realised that bin Laden was out of their reach, they looked towards Iraq. Ultimately, it was a lost cause and the only people who benefitted were the original targets; the Taliban and bin Laden. Overall, Descent into Chaos is a rivetting tome, which questions the need for such a war and provides an in-indepth perspective on the 'black hole' of the world: Afghanistan